Relay-Version: B 2.11 6/12/87; site scolex Path: uunet!uunet!cs.utexas.edu!bunda From: bunda@cs.utexas.edu (John Bunda) Newsgroups: rec.aviation Subject: Aircraft Tire Survey Summary Message-ID: <1567@needmore.cs.utexas.edu> Date: Thu, 20 Jun 91 13:32:21 PDT Organization: U Texas Dept of Computer Sciences, Austin TX Lines: 141 This is not one of those one-size-fits-all questions, and of course, literally, your mileage may vary, but here is a summary of the tire survey, thanks to all who replied. To bring the issue down to earth, where the rubber meets the wallet as it were, here are typical discount prices for 600x6 8-ply rating tires from Trade-a-Plane: Retread $27.50 McCreary Air Trac $47.00 McCreary Air Hawk $55.00 Goodyear Flight Special II $74.00 Goodyear Flight Custom II $92.00 My recollection of the Aviation Consumer article was (A) actually from the Light Plane Maintenance Body Maintenance book and (B) wrong (thanks to Michael Paton and Bluejay Adametz). LPM Body Maintenance (quoted/paraphrased without permission): "Most large fleet operators agree that if your utilization rate is low - if you fly no more than 100 or 200 hours a year - a "cheap" tire (a McCreary Air Trac, or equivalent) will fall apart or succumb to severe weather checking before it will wear out. In other words, a cheap tire is best used on a high-utilization aircraft (a trainer fleet, for instance). If your plane sits on the ramp for extended periods of time and logs fewer than ten landings a month, ... only a premium tire will last long enough to wear out. ... "A premium tire will outlast a cheap tire under *any* conditions. In our opinion, it pays to buy the best, [...] Goodyear Flight Customs, [...] the best tire on the market, followed by Flight Specials. (At the bottom of our list are tires made by McCreary [which] includes the Goodrich Silvertown line [which] McCreary manufactures. "The main difference between Flight Customs and Flight Specials is more rubber, and [Customs will] wear up to 35 percent longer..." "You can tell retreads by the presence of the letter "R" on the sidewall, followed by a number...the number of times the carcass has been retreaded [...] Retreads tend to swell [after installation] more so than regular tires - possibly creating problems with fairings, wheel wells, gear doors..." From: Geoff Peck : I swear by the Goodyear Flight Custom II's. I've had Flight Specials, too, which seem to wear out noticeably faster, and McCrearys (I forget which quality level), which wore out even faster. From: papworth@ichips.intel.com: The previous owner [of my Archer] used McCreary Air Hawks, replacing them at each annual inspection, whether needed or not. They wore out in just 14 months...[but the] tires were pretty well worn before I got the plane. I had the expensive Goodyear (Goodrich?) tires put on by a local FBO (and paid their high markup for the tires). The tires have lasted like iron; after 400 hours and maybe 500 landings they still look like brand new. The next time I need new tires I'll buy a premium brand...Don't mess around with the cheapo McCrearys. [And don't pay FBO markup]. From: Bill Robie : I have had fairly - no, very - good luck with retreads [on a fleet of ultralights]. They may not last quite as long as high-buck tires, but nearly so. At half the price, the economics are favourable. I have seen retreads on "local" jump planes that seemed to last a looooong time. On rare occasion you will get a bad one - perhaps a bump in the tread - but it is usually something that is immediately obvious and is made good by the dealer. I have never seen one delaminate like truck tires do. I also question your source of information on McCreary tires. My first set lasted nearly ten years and were replaced because of "checking" rather than wear. I was not putting hard use on them (like we did the retreads), but they seemed to be just fine as far as tires go. From: bluejay@feathr.enet.dec.com (Bluejay Adametz) If your airplane makes a lot of landings over calendar time, I'd put the cheapest retreads I could find on it (how cheap? depends on how many landings). The large number of landing will wear out the tire relatively rapidly no matter what tire you put on, so you might as well get the cheap ones. If your airplane doesn't make many landings, I'd get the best tire I could afford. A cheaper tire will begin to experience rubber deterioration before it gets worn. From: Tom Neale When I bought my Cardinal RG it had 1 McCreary and 1 GY Flight Custom II on the mains. The McCreary was worn through to the cords in less than 50 hours while the FC II is now a usable spare in my garage. I really don't think they were put on at the same time. But I think they were very close. When I replaced them both I put on FC IIs. They have lasted >550 hours, and well over 400 landings. My mechanic (a former inspection supervisor for United at SFO) tells me that I've gotten more than double the standard life out these tires. He also tells me that United uses Goodyear and that they recap each tire 7-9 times before they throw the cores out! Recaps are probably fine - if they are (re)made by Goodyear or equivalent. From: tempest!mpaton@oakhill.UUCP (Michael J Paton x2620) I personally use the more expensive McCreary, and have no complaints at all....I don't think it matters very much if your tires take normal pressure like 25 to 40 psi. Above this, they are evidently under some load and a "better" tire may be worth it. BTW aircraft retreads are quite common and are frequently used on commercial jetliners: several times over. I heard from the mechanics at Lockhart that they quite frequently use Wilkerson brand retreads with very few problems. If it makes the pilot happier they will retread your own carcasses and return them to you, so you at least know what sort of a history they've had. So while it's all down to personal preference, I don't think retreads are especially inadvisable. Nobody seems to do tests on wet-weather braking which you might think could be a concern. ---------------------------- Thanks to all who replied. Since the cost of tires is relatively low compared to the hassle of changing them, it's tempting to go with the Goodyear FC II's. However, I think I'm going to give retreads a try. My plane flies a lot, usually about 10 hours a week, so the tires should wear out before they deteriorate. Besides, I don't have wheel pants on the 182, so they're relatively easy to inspect, and no clearance problems. -- John Bunda * bunda@cs.utexas.edu * {uunet,harvard}!cs.utexas.edu!bunda